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How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

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    #16
    Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

    Let's not overestimate Dent offensively. He was at the tail end of the era of the light-hitting shortstop; contemporary with him, and before Ripken, guys like Yount and Trammell and Templeton and even Toby Harrah were around. (Also remember that Patek and Campaneris were base-stealers.)

    Dent was a pretty good fielder - decent but not great range, made the plays he could get to. For the Yankees, the most important thing was that he was adequate. In 1976, they had Jim Mason and Fred Stanley at SS, both entirely inadequate. Dent was overrated as a Yankee, but he was a perfectly decent major-league shortstop, which was what they needed.
    History is our lessons to learn good things to do and bad things to not do.
    - MTG

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      #17
      Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

      I'm going to take this opportunity to tell a Phil Rizzuto story. The Yanks were playing an away game, I think it was Boston, at the time when new public address announcers were popping up who would announce the starting lineups like today's NBA announcers, loud and boisterous etc. Rizzuto didn't like it, and listening to Bob Sheppard's stately voice for years had him convinced that there was no other way. So the Yankee lineup was being introduced and you could hear it clearly in the background. After every name Rizzuto had a comment. "I can't believe this." Next name...."Can you believe this, White?" Finally, the announcer finishes with "BUCK-YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnt!" This time Rizzuto really raises his voice, "Oh man, this guy has GOT TO GO!" After all these years I can remember that...probably because not too many announcers could get away with criticizing somebody the way Phil did. For those of us who listened in the 60s and 70s we have lots of good Rizzuto stories, although I don't know if they translate well into words.
      Let the kids play.

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        #18
        Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

        Originally posted by Bub View Post
        I'm going to take this opportunity to tell a Phil Rizzuto story. The Yanks were playing an away game, I think it was Boston, at the time when new public address announcers were popping up who would announce the starting lineups like today's NBA announcers, loud and boisterous etc. Rizzuto didn't like it, and listening to Bob Sheppard's stately voice for years had him convinced that there was no other way. So the Yankee lineup was being introduced and you could hear it clearly in the background. After every name Rizzuto had a comment. "I can't believe this." Next name...."Can you believe this, White?" Finally, the announcer finishes with "BUCK-YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnt!" This time Rizzuto really raises his voice, "Oh man, this guy has GOT TO GO!" After all these years I can remember that...probably because not too many announcers could get away with criticizing somebody the way Phil did. For those of us who listened in the 60s and 70s we have lots of good Rizzuto stories, although I don't know if they translate well into words.
        "I'll be home soon, Cora!"
        Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

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          #19
          Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

          Originally posted by JL25and3 View Post
          Let's not overestimate Dent offensively. He was at the tail end of the era of the light-hitting shortstop; contemporary with him, and before Ripken, guys like Yount and Trammell and Templeton and even Toby Harrah were around. (Also remember that Patek and Campaneris were base-stealers.)

          Dent was a pretty good fielder - decent but not great range, made the plays he could get to. For the Yankees, the most important thing was that he was adequate. In 1976, they had Jim Mason and Fred Stanley at SS, both entirely inadequate. Dent was overrated as a Yankee, but he was a perfectly decent major-league shortstop, which was what they needed.
          A good assessment, and of course he hit one of the most memorable homers in Yankee history, which gives him a free pass into Yankee stardom in my book, so I don't ever want to hear anything bad about Bucky Dent. ...or Aaron Boone.
          Let the kids play.

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            #20
            Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

            Originally posted by Bub View Post
            A good assessment, and of course he hit one of the most memorable homers in Yankee history, which gives him a free pass into Yankee stardom in my book, so I don't ever want to hear anything bad about Bucky Dent. ...or Aaron Boone.
            He had also had a fine offensive series against the Dodgers in 78 World Series. He might have been named the series mvp but I'm not certain about that. (I think light hitting Brian Doyle also came up big in that series)
            You wanna know what? You gotta problem with Luis Cessa, you gotta problem with me. And I suggest you let that one marinate

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              #21
              Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

              Originally posted by longtimeyankeefan View Post
              "I'll be home soon, Cora!"
              Especially if there's a storm.

              "Sky's getting dark here at the stadium.....Peterson winds, and the pitch is outside, ball one,"

              Loud crack of thunder.
              Sound of dropped microphone.
              Sound of chair being pushed away from desk.
              15 minutes of radio silence, other than background crowd noise.
              Let the kids play.

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                #22
                Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                Here's a couple of somehow-slightly-related questions:

                Who was an overall better player, Bucky Dent or Aaron Boone?

                A couple of power-hitting shortstops succeeded both players:

                Roy Smalley succeeded Bucky @ SS in 1983. They were both around 30 at the time. Who was the better player?

                A-Rod succeeded Boone @ 3B in 2003. Boone was 30, A-Rod was 27. Based purely on speculation and since Aaron's brother is Bret, who did more PEDs, Aaron or Alex?
                "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

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                  #23
                  Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                  Originally posted by sjb23 View Post
                  Here's a couple of somehow-slightly-related questions:

                  Who was an overall better player, Bucky Dent or Aaron Boone?

                  A couple of power-hitting shortstops succeeded both players:

                  Roy Smalley succeeded Bucky @ SS in 1983. They were both around 30 at the time. Who was the better player?

                  A-Rod succeeded Boone @ 3B in 2003. Boone was 30, A-Rod was 27. Based purely on speculation and since Aaron's brother is Bret, who did more PEDs, Aaron or Alex?
                  Smalley, Jr had back issues and his best days were behind him when the Yankees got him. He was an offensive SS and his offense was greatly diminished by then. At leasthat's how I remember it.
                  You wanna know what? You gotta problem with Luis Cessa, you gotta problem with me. And I suggest you let that one marinate

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                    Originally posted by fredgmuggs View Post
                    He had also had a fine offensive series against the Dodgers in 78 World Series. I might have been named the series mvp but I'm not certain about that. (I think light hitting Brian Doyle also came up big in that series)
                    Doyle and Dent were spraying the ball all over the place in that series.
                    Let the kids play.

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                      #25
                      Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                      Originally posted by Bub View Post
                      Doyle and Dent were spraying the ball all over the place in that series.
                      I remember Johnny Carson poking fun at Dent in one of his monologues during the series. He said something like, 'Bucky Dent? That's not a person's name, that's the name of a denture cream for beavers'.
                      You wanna know what? You gotta problem with Luis Cessa, you gotta problem with me. And I suggest you let that one marinate

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                        To be honest, before the moment recalled in the sig I have had since 2001, I barely knew who BFD was. Afterwards, I will never, ever forget him.

                        He was just there, getting the job done on defense, and getting the occasional hit. There were plenty of others on those teams to be your heroes.
                        "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

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                          #27
                          Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                          Originally posted by theDurk View Post
                          To be honest, before the moment recalled in the sig I have had since 2001, I barely knew who BFD was. Afterwards, I will never, ever forget him.

                          He was just there, getting the job done on defense, and getting the occasional hit. There were plenty of others on those teams to be your heroes.
                          The reason that White announced this HR is that Rizzuto had to leave after the 3rd inning to beat the crowd across the GWB (even though the game was in Boston).
                          Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

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                            #28
                            Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                            Originally posted by fredgmuggs View Post
                            Bucky was a dependable shortstop (in the words of Tommy John - an out is out with Dent at SS) but he wasn't a dazzling fielder who took away hits in the weak hitting/great glove Mark Belanger mold.
                            Muggz - there are some people here that may not know who Tommy John is.
                            They might think he was a doctor that invented a certain surgery....

                            "Leave it to Yankees fans to be upset at having too many great players.Hitman23

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                              #29
                              Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                              Originally posted by cupcollector99 View Post
                              that was a different era. A guy could hit in the low .200s and get away with being a role playing guy but he managed to start and hold down the fort at SS for the Yanks. Not recalling the stats, I do remember he played well when they needed it, like Brosius. He was more of a pop idol, he had the haircut and the girls thought he was cute and I believe he posed for Playgirl and had cameos on TV shows. He put fannies in the seats..
                              My wife was a huge fan of Bucky's. But when we saw one of those cameos on a TV movie about the Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders, she groaned and hoped that he would never act again.
                              Yankee fan living in Maine.

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                                #30
                                Re: How horrible was Bucky Dent ?

                                Originally posted by Nome View Post
                                This is where the Sabermatics fanatics go wrong. Pure stats don't tell all. You had to see him play to appreciate him. No he wasn't a superstar, but he was more valuable than the stats would indicate

                                Andy
                                Actually, sabermetrics loved Bucky Dent. He was nearly ~3 WAR player from '78 through '80, based entirely on his defensive value offsetting his offensive woes, which put him ahead of guys like Alan Trammell and Ozzie Smith. Fifth best in baseball.

                                So this is where "anti-Sabermatics fanatics" go wrong. They don't understand them and bemoan them, even when ironically they would support the position you are trying to make that traditional stats simply cannot.

                                Admittedly, I was far too young to appreciate watching him, and as a slick fielding shortstop for a '78 team that had a pitching staff that saw a ton of balls put in play (5.0 K/9 as a staff, more than 50% lower than the '13 Yankees for example) he was a good fit. And obviously, hit one of the most iconic and important HR in Yankee history. All that said, he was atrocious on the balance at the plate for that era, and I'm confident that not seeing the games at that time I wasn't missing a whole lot on that front.

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