Covid-19

[Yankee Tripper]

Can you stop replying to my posts with links without quoting a part of the article you want me to look at? I have no idea what you are showing here.

It's right in the title of the study

Research shows many with mild COVID-19 infections still experience long-term symptoms

[ClownPickle]

I think Trapper probably has better info on it that I do but I don't believe your statement is correct.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0804210117.htm

Can you stop replying to my posts with links without quoting a part of the article you want me to look at? I have no idea what you are showing here.

[trapper700]

10-30% figure isn't for mild cases though.

"There has been conflicting information regarding whether asymptomatic individuals go on to become long-haulers, and roughly 32% of those reporting symptoms at day 61+ in our study were initially asymptomatic at the time of SARS-CoV-2 testing."
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....03.21252086v1

"Post-COVID conditions were found to a greater extent in patients who had more severe cases of COVID-19, but also in a substantial share of patients whose cases lacked symptoms. Of patients who were hospitalized with COVID-19, the percentage that had a post-COVID condition was 50 percent; of patients who were symptomatic but not hospitalized, 27.5 percent; and of patients who were asymptomatic, 19 percent."
https://s3.amazonaws.com/media2.fair...te%20Paper.pdf

I think Trapper probably has better info on it that I do but I don't believe your statement is correct.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0804210117.htm

Thanks, I was going to reference this as well, but it said "mild or moderate" so I didn't want the response to be "this isn't just mild, it could have been moderate covid that leads to long covid"

[Yankee Tripper]

10-30% figure isn't for mild cases though.

I think Trapper probably has better info on it that I do but I don't believe your statement is correct.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0804210117.htm

[ClownPickle]

Anywhere between 10% and 30% of people who get covid get long covid. Some studies even showing half of patients having at least one long covid symptom 6 months after the initial infection

10-30% figure isn't for mild cases though.

[RhodyYanksFan]

Three weeks ago Omicron was worse than now.

I understand that, but it's not like it's dropped to where things were in June. We're still over 250,000 reported cases a day. Even in the worst of delta that was rarely over 100k.

[trapper700]

How common are these?

Anywhere between 10% and 30% of people who get covid get long covid. Some studies even showing half of patients having at least one long covid symptom 6 months after the initial infection.

Can cases of the normal flu cause similar issues?

There are cases of long haul flu, but not nearly as frequently and not as severe. As the list of things show, long covid is more than just a respiratory disease as it affects different parts of your body/organs/systems. Flu, even long haul flu, is primarily a respiratory disease. Long covid also usually resulted in multiple symptoms instead of just one or two.

[ClownPickle]

Covid is exponentially more infective than any kind of flu has ever been. The new BA2 variant, for example, is about 30% more infective than the original omicron and you will get it the moment you are in a room maskless (or take it off to eat/drink) with someone who has it.

Covid also doesn't care about natural immunity or vaccination/boosters when it comes to reinfection. Prior infection with omicron results in poor immune protection from getting it again, same with breakthrough infections.

Covid has a long long long list of problems it can cause in someone's body, even if they had a "mild" case when they first got infected:

• It can cause brain changes that are similar to alzheimers. It causes abnormalities in different molecules that cause disfunction in cells in the central nervous system.
• It can combine with a protein in Parkinson's causing amyloid formation - a hallmark of Parkinson's disease. Young people w/ covid can devlop it.
• It can cause prolonged damage to the immune system in general. There is evidence of cell death and tissue repair in those with persistent lung disease. It also kills T Cells and causes more T Cell death than HIV. This lack of T cells might also be the cause of symptoms persisting for months after initial infection. Because of the weakened immune system, people are more vulnerable to diseases and pathogens usually seen only in those who are immunocompromised - like mucormycosis.
• It can cause long term cardiovascular disease and greatly increases the risk of strokes, heart attacks, pulmonary embolism, etc, even for those who were not sick enough to get hospitalized due to covid.
• It can cause systemic infection and can persist in the body for months (even for those who were asymptomatic).
• It causes greatly increased mortality rates in the first 12 months in those who were previously hospitalized (233% in < 65 yo).
• It can cause type-2 diabetes and pancreatic damage in adults or type-1 diabetes and in children (also possibly with celiac disease).

How common are these? Can cases of the normal flu cause similar issues?

[YFIB]

I know full well what it means, but I was responding to Rhody saying "This is why nobody knows what to believe." The implication in March 2020 was that if we listened to the science, we wouldn't still be talking about masks, isolation, and ER availability in 2022.

If we'd listened to science and just had vaccination rates at the level of the rest of the Western world, we'd have lower death rates and likely wouldn't be talking about ER availability. Two years ago, who would have guessed we'd make vaccination a political issue and watch people die needlessly?

[trapper700]

Why do you think it'll be worse than the flu? I'm hopeful it will be similar, but admittedly I'm not a physician or scientist.

Covid is exponentially more infective than any kind of flu has ever been. The new BA2 variant, for example, is about 30% more infective than the original omicron and you will get it the moment you are in a room maskless (or take it off to eat/drink) with someone who has it.

Covid also doesn't care about natural immunity or vaccination/boosters when it comes to reinfection. Prior infection with omicron results in poor immune protection from getting it again, same with breakthrough infections.

Covid has a long long long list of problems it can cause in someone's body, even if they had a "mild" case when they first got infected:

• It can cause brain changes that are similar to alzheimers. It causes abnormalities in different molecules that cause disfunction in cells in the central nervous system.
• It can combine with a protein in Parkinson's causing amyloid formation - a hallmark of Parkinson's disease. Young people w/ covid can devlop it.
• It can cause prolonged damage to the immune system in general. There is evidence of cell death and tissue repair in those with persistent lung disease. It also kills T Cells and causes more T Cell death than HIV. This lack of T cells might also be the cause of symptoms persisting for months after initial infection. Because of the weakened immune system, people are more vulnerable to diseases and pathogens usually seen only in those who are immunocompromised - like mucormycosis.
• It can cause long term cardiovascular disease and greatly increases the risk of strokes, heart attacks, pulmonary embolism, etc, even for those who were not sick enough to get hospitalized due to covid.
• It can cause systemic infection and can persist in the body for months (even for those who were asymptomatic).
• It causes greatly increased mortality rates in the first 12 months in those who were previously hospitalized (233% in < 65 yo).
• It can cause type-2 diabetes and pancreatic damage in adults or type-1 diabetes and in children (also possibly with celiac disease).

[Maynerd]

Two years later and you still haven't learned what that means. Amazing.

I know full well what it means, but I was responding to Rhody saying "This is why nobody knows what to believe." The implication in March 2020 was that if we listened to the science, we wouldn't still be talking about masks, isolation, and ER availability in 2022.

[YankeePride1967]

I know it's not just about NJ, I'm just trying to figure out why it's happening now here. I do agree with you that there are fairly obvious political incentives in other states.

I think mostly political and also Omicron is almost gone so gives them a “reason”. I think unless another variant comes (I think they will as still too few people worldwide are unvaccinated) mandates will go away

[RYMASTER or Ryan_Yankees]

Yes NJ is one of 3 that isn’t up but the rest are. And this isn’t just about NJ. It is the other states removing the mandates. Multiple blue states are doing so. Even beyond Governor the US House and 1/3 of the Senate are up for election

I know it's not just about NJ, I'm just trying to figure out why it's happening now here. I do agree with you that there are fairly obvious political incentives in other states.

[Texsahara]

If that's the strategy it's a poor one. Seems like most voters will fall into three groups as it relates to this issue:

1. Anti-school mask mandators. This group may be appeased that the mandates are being lifted, but they will still resent that they were issued and the removal in their minds will validate their views on masks being unnecessary and/or harmful for kids. Limited if any impact on votes.
2. Pro-school mask mandators. Many in this group may be reasonable/indifferent but some will be concerned about greater risk of exposure to their kids in the near term. If another outbreak occurs they may resent R takes on masks but will hold the D leaders accountable. Limited if any impact on votes.
3. Undecideds. The ongoing merry-go-round of mask guidance, if it has any effect at all on this group, probably leaves them confused and with the impression that current leadership lacks credibility. Cloth masks good, cloth masks bad. Need N95s, now no mask mandate at all. Probably limited impact on votes, but leaning towards costing votes.

The only thing working in the Ds favor is the extreme far right position on masks and many other topics that matter to voters IMHO. I think the mid-terms are going to be painful for Ds, but if Rs had any sort of more centrist positions and put Trump in the corner they'd clean up shop.

I don't think specific policies about masks are going to have an impact but the overall look of how covid has been handled will be huge. And that can swing one way or the other depending on how it's going at the time. Voters have short memories. Agree that the mid-terms are going to be painful for Ds though. They have plenty of time to fix that but they don't understand politics.

[Texsahara]

Two weeks to flatten the curve!

Two years later and you still haven't learned what that means. Amazing.